How a Trail Running Brand Reinvented Itself

I didn't really take Kip Run seriously.

Not because they were bad, they just weren't in the conversation.

And then these shoes showed up, and it wasn't one shoe, it was a pattern.

Something about how they're building feels different now.

And Kipron sits inside the Cathlon, which is one of the largest sporting good companies in the world.

And most people in America don't realize it, don't have any awareness of it.

And for a long time, their running felt a little fragmented.

Different names, different ideas.

Not really a clear point of view, in my.

My opinion.

But what they're doing now feels so much more intentional.

So instead of looking at five shoes today, we're looking at the shift at Kipron.

Kipron feels like a brand that has gone through a transformation.

If you're watching on YouTube or on Spotify, Inky is really making the point of what we think is happening at.

At Kip Run.

Inky.

How you doing?

I'm all right.

All right.

Casual.

It's the best.

This is the best you've ever looked?

I think so.

It's hot in there.

Major shift in thinking at.

At Kip Run at Decathlon.

So Decathlon is, in my opinion, just a phenomenal store for someone who's got three kids who are.

Who are dabbling in sports.

And the value proposition of decathlon is that it's affordable stuff and for the price.

You're getting really good quality for the price.

But you.

You probably grew up with Decathlon in Manchester.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I mean, this one probably five or six miles away.

Big, massive, like, warehouse.

Big warehouse.

So Kipron is owned by Decathlon.

It's an extension of decathlon.

When you think of decathlon growing up, you know, going to it all that, like, what do you think of when you think of Decathlon?

She.

Yeah, you know, if you.

If you were running in Kip front shoes, it's almost like running in, like, sketches.

So I mean, it's just like.

Exactly.

Yeah.

It's similar.

Similar.

That kind of similar world, really, where it's like.

Like, your mum's probably bought them for you.

They have this, like, stigma of, like, copying.

Like, oh, we'll copy a Nike shoe, but we'll just write Kit Prun on it.

Oh, you know, sketches on it.

Or, you know, I mean, the silhouette looks very similar, but the actual execution of it isn't very good.

Yeah.

In business, I would always think of that, as I would call.

For years we'd call that.

Me too.

Like, they would see something cool.

And they'd be like, okay, yeah, me too.

That's what Skechers built itself on.

So that's an interesting idea.

Skechers.

If you go into a sketcher store, they have the, okay, here's the section that was inspired by Hoka.

Here's the section that was inspired by on running, you know, and it's, it was like that.

It's something if you start, if you're on a start line of a race, you know, a local race, you see someone with Kip Run kit on, you're like, they're new to this.

Yeah.

They won't be running in the kit.

Wrong shoes.

They'll probably have brooks ghosts on or something like that.

Because I've been to a running shop and you know, they've gone, oh, you're gate, you need these.

What I think they've done is they've actually gone, let's make some good shoes or good looking shoes.

Because I'm not saying the old ones weren't good.

They probably were good, but it's just that now they've gone, let's make them sexy.

Yeah.

And I think that's what they've, they've done because they need to enter that market.

It's like we had the conversation the other day when we were looking at the shoe.

I said, if it didn't have that logo down the side and it was just blacked out.

And you said to me, who's made this shoe?

And I said, a different brand.

They've got a good aesthetic.

Yeah, I, I, yeah.

And I, I hear that as a compliment.

It's saying they've elevated.

I wouldn't have guessed that these shoes strip the logos, look at the silhouette, look at the materials.

Like read it on paper.

You wouldn't have thought Kip Run, that's the return of the Jedi they left.

You know, the shoes that they had were fine.

You could get a pair of trail running shoes for 65, €75.

Yeah.

Unbelievable.

Point of entry into the sport or low budget or you're just not doing ultras.

You're just enjoying some time on the trail.

And I think that's reflective of, of how people run in France.

Like not a lot of ultra runners, but tons of forest runners.

Oh, I'm wearing a shirt that says, that says Forest Run in Germany.

Tons of forest runners, you know, so it's, it was, it was built for this other thing now, Decathlon through Kipron.

They used to have three running brands, Kalingi, Kip Run and Eva Dict.

And they've over the last three years, they've kind of consolidated them all into one and really got focused.

Now that they have returned as Jedis, I think these shoes are com.

Competitive.

They're already landing on podiums, so the elites are liking them.

But you know, for me coming out of the gates, you and I starting with design, I just simply like to look at the shoe.

Yeah.

But we, to be fair though, me and you talked about this shoe, I don't know, four months ago, five months ago, when we first started seeing these pictures pop up and we were like, yeah, they've got some at there, aren't they?

And when these, when these, when these showed up, obviously there was, there was two pairs in the thing.

And I just thought there was one pair.

And I was like, it's pretty light this.

And then I realized it was two pairs in the, in the package.

And I was like, hang on a minute.

That is.

This is, this is.

This has everything that you need to be a trail runner.

Yeah.

This shoe.

And it won't break your bank either.

Right.

I mean, this is for the, the.

Granted I didn't pay for this, but, but the price of it, you, any other brand, you're gonna be 50 pounds more in the UK for something similar.

Unless you're amount to Coast H1.

But this does something that the Mountain Coast H1 doesn't do, which is a lug depth.

Like you can run in proper mud in this.

And it's got, and it's got, and it's got that.

Whenever you see that.

Yeah.

You know, you know you're in for it.

You know you're in for a good shoe.

Yeah.

And to your point, Kip run.

You know, they're, they're based in Lille, France.

So they're, they're built for the Alps.

So when they look at, I mean, Lille is not near the Alps for those north.

But they're French.

And when they think about the, the right shoe, they're building mountain shoes, they're building mountain running shoes.

So this, this grip, these are proper, proper trail shoes.

And you're right.

From a standpoint of price, they come in low because Decathlon, $20 billion company, they know they've got a supply chain that they can really drive, you know, and work to lower costs.

But they're also, you know, want them to last a long time.

So I think from top to bottom, they, they came in.

So maybe here's the point of the Jedi piece.

Now they've returned.

They're competing with the, the biggest brands, you know, capably competing with the biggest brands.

And they did stuff to address materials, they did stuff to address design.

They spent time thinking through color.

And so this brand that was one that was for point of entry for, you know, the random new runner is now one that a runner would.

Could choose from on a lineup of when they're looking for a serious shoe for a serious race.

Yeah, I mean it's.

Yeah.

Although it's called the Max, I wouldn't say it was a Max stack shoe either.

I think it's just called the Max because it's probably do a bit more miles in it than the, the one that you've got with the, the plate in it.

But it doesn't.

It.

It's a real really light shoe.

It's a really light shoe and it's breathable as well.

Like the mesh that it's made out of is pretty cool.

And I like the colors that they've done on it.

From a distance, it makes it look like a different color.

You know, I just like that stuff.

I like that stuff.

You'll like this.

I chatted with the designer.

I've got a video coming out with a guy who designed this shoe, Briuk Brioche Farrell.

I'm sorry, I've just butchered his name.

That design is, is.

Was a nod to hallucinating during ultras.

So he said like, you know, you look down and they're kind of playing with materials or playing with the way that it all came together, that it's supposed to mimic the, the hallucination.

Yeah, I get that.

Totally get that.

Yeah.

So it's called the Max because they also have an entry level one called the Kip Summit.

So the Kip Summit.

Kip Summit Max Kip Summit race.

America's not going to get the Kip Summit because America wants like when all the market testing America wants, wants to spend more.

They see $120, $110 shoe and they don't connect it with value.

They connect it with that's too cheap.

And how can it be good if the average trail running shoe is 150, 160.

So you got H1 coming in at 160.

I've heard that the normal caddy Cadi is going to be coming in around that or a little bit lower.

So people are good shoe as well.

It's a good shoe.

Super comfy.

So this is going to be playing in that world too.

So I like what's happening in trail running is that some prices now, now people realize, okay, we, we Obsessed over materials.

We obsessed over everything and we stopped looking at cost and price and we made these unbelievable shoes.

And now some really smart people like Kip Run, Mountain Coast Normal are saying, hey, there's a massive market now that's grown.

Let's lower the price and compete there.

And I think that's where Kip Run's coming in with these, however, these, which are incredible.

Yeah.

The race day shoe.

Yeah.

In America, I think these are coming in at US$240.

So that's, that's competing with the race day shoe, the carbon plate.

But Cade Michael wore this at Black Canyon, was on the podium.

Toma, who just won Chianti, was wearing these on the podium and got a golden ticket to western states.

Blondine Lerondell, iconic trail runner from France, has worn this, worn these a lot in testing.

So, like, they didn't compromise anything.

They left.

They left a boy and came back a man.

You know what I mean?

I mean that, that shoe that you just showed there, the elite, that's got everything that, that's got everything that any other brand on the market as.

Yep.

That's no worse.

I'm no better.

I mean it sits right in that trail running, I don't know, lineage of elite running shoes.

Yeah.

When, when I'm running here in Paris, I'll run along the sand and there's lots of the, you know, the Eva, Dict, Kalinji, Kip Run, old stuff.

Because most people who are like city runners aren't ultras.

Maybe they're going to run the.

The Paris 10K.

Yeah.

Or the semi, you know, the Perry.

And it's.

They don't have that serious stuff.

But Kip Run is focusing on.

They're coming at everything, road, track, trail, everything.

And so the, the whole system, just a massive shift that was behind the scenes.

I mean, they've got all these other things happening, you know.

What's this?

The tempo.

Tempo.

This is when I put the most miles in this year because I love this phone.

This is the Kip Ride Max.

And then what the elite, I mean, like, they've just got this whole thing of.

They got this whole thing going.

I mean, I don't know how much they had to invest to turn it around and why they chose to keep one of their internal brands and smash the other into it.

It just feels like they needed one.

Lift, they needed one having three.

What they've done is they've gone from budget to competing.

Yeah, that's what they've done.

Because no, they're not New to making shoes.

They've been making them for years and years and years.

They've just not, they've just not been bothered to go after, you know, the vapor fly market, the, you know, Adidas ADI 0.

They obviously weren't bothered.

And then all of a sudden runnings as big as it's probably not, it's probably getting to the, the peak now in it, I would have thought.

Now anybody that's anybody has bought a pair of running shoes and he's now running.

So maybe they've looked at it and gone, let's see some of these on the start lines of races.

Instead of coming at the back of, instead of going at the back of a 10k, let's get on the front.

Let's get on the front.

But they've done it with.

You can definitely see nods to other brands.

But they're all doing that.

It's not that they're ripping anybody off.

Yeah, like the sock.

Yeah, yeah.

But they've like, they've looked at it and they've gone, oh well, you know, we like this mesh or we like this mesh.

I mean, I've tampered with mine a little bit.

Oh my gosh.

So mine's a work in progress.

Sorry Kipron, but I can't run in beige shoes.

Yeah.

So, okay, this is my, this is the Road Elite.

Storm Elite.

Yeah, that's the Kip Storm Elite.

That's their, that's their race day road shoe that used to be beige and is now red.

Yeah.

What else are you going to do?

That shoe?

I'm not 100% sure yet.

That's why.

It's just, it's, it stayed like this for a couple of weeks.

Cuz I've just been debating.

How did you do that?

Stuck it in a vat of dye.

Really?

Yeah.

Did you like tape over anything?

No, no, no.

Straight in.

So it just, it just didn't stick to one of the parts?

Yeah, just a little bit.

Just bits of the bits of the fabric just didn't take us as well.

But the foam really, it really took to the phone.

Yeah, I'm impressed.

I was thinking that was a different paint that you put on there, but.

Not on that bit.

How bizarre.

Yeah, so that's what I was thinking.

Like.

Did you tape that off?

No, no, no.

It's just happy accident.

Happy accident.

So in general.

Yeah, I, that was going to be one of my questions.

I, I don't, I don't like white on white.

I do like this beige on white and I, But You.

I knew that you would.

Or I. I would guess that you wouldn't, but you really drove that home for me today by showing up with it.

Red.

Yeah.

Sorry, Kit room and the designers at Kip Run, but I don't feel like I've.

I feel like we've just enhanced.

Enhanced.

I've not taken away.

Yeah.

Do you think you'd put other color?

Like, would you do other.

Yeah, I just would love to know, like, you know, let's get inside Inky's head.

What.

What's the perfect version.

What's the perfect colorway of this.

This shoe that you could put together?

Not sure I'm in.

I mean, a million different minds, but this is a comfortable shoe, by the way, guys.

Comfortable shoe.

And it's light.

This is.

It's a light, light, light, light shoe.

I'm not running it yet, obviously, but it's got loads of tread on it.

It's got a massive carbon plate in it.

I put about.

I think this is probably what led to my injury because I was just trying so many shoes, and I was also like, I'm 43, but I. I've been.

I'm running the fastest I had ever been running, and I just feel really, really great, and I'm going hard.

I had a really great five weeks of playing with different shoes and running faster than I should have, but I put in a really solid, I think, 24 miler in those shoes.

And my goodness.

And I did a separate 25, 26 miler in the Kip Summit races.

Yeah, it's just having a blast.

And then the bulk of my training was in the Kip ride Max.

The Max has, like, a really, really soft foam.

They call it soft tech.

I feel like they.

They built the naming system for idiots like me because, yeah, it's not a technical name.

It's just, here's our soft foam.

Yeah.

For long distances.

Here's our fast tech for that.

They've optimized for going faster.

And then this one even says, made for race.

No one's going to ever see it.

Right.

Unless they're right behind you and you're kicking off air like no one's ever going to see it.

That could be true.

When you start puking at the end, lying on the ground.

Yeah.

Gosh.

What else?

I mean, for me, my take on this is, okay, so we've been sort of gushing about them.

They've.

Because.

Because I'm impressed of turning something around.

Like, they could have started from scratch.

I think if they started fully from Scratch without everyone knowing that Decathlon was behind him.

I think it might have.

There's an element of.

But to me, the thing that I.

That, you know, one great year doesn't make a heritage iconic brand.

To me, what.

What will next year's models be?

And I.

And I know I critique that whole system.

You have critiqued it too, because, you know, you loved the Tecton X2s, didn't love the X3s, you know, but there.

Is something in that.

Like, this is a really nice shoe.

Could it be better?

Yeah, I don't think this is finished yet.

I think they'll do some other bits to this.

I certainly think they will.

To the elite one.

I think that'll come in lighter.

I think they'll probably foam compound.

They'll probably do one of these with dual foams in it.

A bit like what this one's got where the heel counter as a different.

As a firmer foam than what's above it to obviously give it that stability when you, when you're running in this.

This is the tempo.

Yeah.

So I think they'll do something similar with this where they might have, like a harder foam.

Because I've.

I've got a feeling that this.

People might say it's slightly unstable maybe.

I mean, I've not run, like, technical trails, but.

Yeah, this foam.

This foam is soft.

It is soft foam.

Yeah.

So maybe they'll.

They'll.

They'll do a, A more stacked version of this for those, like, 100 milers.

Because I'm not sure there's enough in this for me to do 100 miler in this.

Yeah.

Or maybe they'll do a max, where it is more max, but then they'll do this one where it's a bit more techy.

Bit like one of the other shoes that we'll talk about in a bit with what they've done with their phone.

Yeah.

I feel like the.

The on this shoe.

This is the race day shoe, the Kip Summit race.

I feel like it's.

It's too much shoe for me to do in 100 miler.

It's because of the type of runner I am.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And I'm being nice.

Not a great runner.

I don't want a carbon plate for 100 miles.

It hurts.

It starts to hurt.

It's not the shoe, it's the runner.

That's right.

It's not you.

Yeah, this is, this is.

This is something that we, you know, we.

We always have to address like.

Yeah, you know, I talk about shoes that I don't like, but I don't like them because I'm not good enough to use them.

Yeah.

Somebody else.

I'm not saying you can't run 100 mile in this.

Yeah, people will run 100 miles in this, but they are better than me and they're better than you probably do.

You know what I mean?

Yeah.

Yeah.

I do think if I do a road Ultra, I'm definitely going for the Kip Ride maxes because of that soft tech.

And as I get more time on feet and get ready to go back to America and figure out what races I'm going to do this fall.

Yeah, I mean, the shorter ones, I'll totally jump in with it with a carbon plate, but again, it just.

It's not where I want to be for longer than a marathon.

And also that integrated sock that starts to hurt the top of my foot on every.

In any shoe.

It's not, It's.

It's not unique to Brooks.

It's not unique to Kip Run.

It's just that thing always starts to put pressure on the top of my foot in a way that feels comfortable over 25 miles.

Yeah, I mean, I'm out.

Yeah, I'm out with that, to be honest with you.

I just think that's.

That, that is the, the carbon plate phase in the shoe.

You know what I mean?

Where they've all gone, we need.

We need.

They're all putting this sock on the.

On the top of the top of the ankle.

We have to bring a shoe out that, that, that does that.

Otherwise people won't buy it.

We're not legit.

Yeah, see, no one cares, honestly, you know, No.

I wish I had the normal caddies in front of me, but they now put the logo on top of the.

Yeah, the toe.

And I was hanging out with some of them last week, two weeks ago, and they were like, yep.

Because people take their selfies downward onto their feet.

Now you can get that and get the normal logo, which, to their defense, that shoe, we mentioned it earlier.

Gosh, super good shoe.

And I think that's.

It's a good snapshot because they built that shoe.

So many companies have been, you know, as they.

As they optimize their shoe, let's say, portfolio when they're considering America.

America needs comfortable shoes, like the high stack, all that sort of stuff, like, disproportionately.

So you got these Alps, these high mountain Alps.

Runners who, like, you know, the ground feel and the lower foam and the, you know, more as I always think of, like these F1 shoes that are low profile and America just wants suburbans, you know, wants these big shoes, lots of foam.

And so I think that's what the max was about.

That's what the, the normal caddy is about, you know, that, that there's still a lot of market share to take in America.

And it's a.

And it's a big market and so they're, they're optimizing for.

Comfy.

Yeah.

And I think like just, you know, from the, the way you run a trail, an American trail, I mean, I've never done it, it's on my list, but I've never run a trail in America.

But I imagine it's pretty different to a trail that you'd run in the uk, you know, I mean it's pretty different to one you'd run in France or northern Spain or, you know, Gran Canaria, you know, because obviously the weather, the climate's different.

So like here it's just you're running through boggy fields so, you know, you don't, you need grip, whereas, you know, some dusty trails, you don't want a massive, you don't, you don't need that.

It's not necessary.

So trail running so much harder to navigate than road running because.

Tarmac, Tarmac.

Right, good point.

So you can't.

There's never going to be the number one trail shoe because there's a number one trail shoe for that particular event.

For big mountain, for technical, for.

Yeah, desert.

Yeah.

I will say I thought this was only going to be a mountain shoe and that's how I was viewing it.

That's what I was preparing.

Because where I live is great mountain running in Salt Lake City when we move back.

But then Cade Michael goes to Black Canyon and you know, the 50k gets on the podium in this shoe and I was like, oh, wow.

Okay.

I wasn't expecting that to be like a great desert thing.

Not because a.

It's, I mean, it's simply because the dirt, like the dirt getting in to your shoe just rubs your feet so raw over the course of an ultra.

So I was surprised to see that.

But to your point, I agree that the shoes that I run into my desert ultras were very different than my mountain ultras.

Well, also, you know, that guy that won, that is a great runner, so.

That's right.

It's the shoe is this, you know, ain't gonna be out there that long.

You know, I mean?

Yeah, he's doing a 50k in, what, three and a half hours?

Yeah, yeah.

It's like.

Like with Alex doing run the other week.

Yeah, he did the Black Canyons, didn't he?

Yeah, he did the 50k.

Yep.

Yeah.

You know, I mean, like, they're.

They're out less than four hours, man.

You know, I mean, that's nothing, is it, really, in the grand scheme of things.

Yeah, yeah.

Before you've.

Before you've.

You know, your feet are done, you.

You've sat there with your beer, aren't you, and your hamburger or whatever, chilling, watching all these other ones.

Take forever now.

Take 8 hours or 10 hours to get it done.

Right.

And to your point, there's no way they're enjoying it.

They're enjoying themselves.

But in the middle of it, they're not.

Enjoy.

Well, I put a bow on it.

I think that.

Go ahead and put your mask back on.

I think that you nailed it, Inky, when you said, this is Return of the Jedi, that Kipron started as a young Padawan, you know, doing his thing, and it worked.

And now all of a sudden, they go away, they come back, and they are.

They are a Jedi.

So.

Good call.

Yeah.

All right, man.

Well, let's do it again.